Interview with COSE

Partial Transcript: Steven Payne: Welcome to the Bronx Aerosol Arts Documentary Project. My name is Steven Payne, librarian and archivist at The Bronx County Historical Society. Today is January 19, 2022, and this is the second oral history recorded for the project. Kurt, you wanna go ahead and introduce yourself?

Kurt Boone: Yeah, I'm Kurt, Kurt Boone. I'm a writer, and I've been writing about urban culture for 40 years.

Steven Payne: Alright, great, thank you, Kurt. And we're really happy to be here, really honored to be here with COSE TDS, the legendary style master affiliated with TDS a.k.a. The Death Squad, and COSE is also a longtime Bronxite, really, almost from birth, since he was age 3, and COSE has his art already in a lot of places: the Museum of the City of New York has, has the largest collection of his artwork. He's been interviewed, received a lot of awards, just received recognition from, from The Bronx for all of his contributions to hip hop culture in general, particularly around graffiti writing, and we're just really happy to be here with COSE . . .

Segment Synopsis: In this segment, Dr. Steven Payne, librarian and archivist at The Bronx County Historical Society, and Kurt Boone, introduce themselves as well as COSE (TDS), one of the most prolific graffiti artists from The Bronx during the Golden Age of graffiti during the early 1980s.

Keywords: Bronx County Historical Society

Subjects: Bronx (New York, N.Y.); Cose (Graffiti artist); Graffiti artists; The Death Squad (Graffiti artist group)

Partial Transcript: COSE: First and foremost, I want to thank you, Steven, and you Kurt. Thank you for even giving me the opportunity to express myself and give you a little brief history about who I am. And with that being said, well, my family came from Puerto Rico . . .

Segment Synopsis: In this segment of the oral history, COSE speaks about his birth in Manhattan, his move to The Bronx, the various schools he attended (briefly), his early days of graffiti writing, the word "graffiti" and its history, and the lack of documentation of his early work. He also goes more into his family roots in Puerto Rico, what the various places he's lived in The Bronx have been like—including differences between private and public residences—where he hung out in the neighborhood as a child, his lifelong love of nature and animals, travels, and what he did for fun around the neighborhood.

Keywords: Aguadilla (P.R.); Alexander Burger Middle School/I.S. 139 (The Bronx, N.Y.); Bombing (Graffiti); Brown Place (The Bronx, N.Y.); Double dutch (Rope skipping); East 136th Street (The Bronx, N.Y.); East 137th Street (The Bronx, N.Y.); Graffiti; Hip-hop; Hopscotch; Johnny On the Spot; Kick the Can; Manhattan Vocational and Technical High School; Manhunt; Morris High School; Mount Sinai Hospital (New York, N.Y.); P.S. 154 (The Bronx, N.Y.); Ponce (P.R.); Ringolevio; Run, Catch, and Kiss; Skateboarding; Skully/skelly/skellies; Willis Avenue (The Bronx, N.Y.)

Subjects: Arson; Bronx (New York, N.Y.); Community centers; East Harlem (New York, N.Y.); Exotic animals; Graffiti; Graffiti artists; Housing--Abandonment; Migration, Internal--United States; Mott Haven (New York, N.Y.); Nature; Public housing; Puerto Ricans; Rural-urban migration--United States; Street games; Voyages and travels

Partial Transcript: COSE: The one that really sticks out in my mind is Manhattan Vocational, because that ties into what we're doing this interview for, basically, you know, who I am, a Bronxite and graffiti art. This is where—cause there's a kid from my neighborhood that went to that school. His name is BO (OTB), BO ROCK, he's another graffiti artist, a little older, he's like two or three years older than me . . .

Segment Synopsis: In this segment COSE speaks about his experience in high school at Manhattan Vocational, particularly the other graffiti artists he met there, and the times he skipped school to write. He also talks about the threat of physical violence from other graffiti crews, especially white ones, his struggles with drugs over the years, episodes from his teenage years and early adulthood that he regrets but that still made him who he is, and ambitions he had during high school.

Keywords: 149th Street–Grand Concourse station; Bo (Graffiti artist); Bombing (Graffiti); Cap (Graffiti artist); Coats--sheepskin; Cope2 (Graffiti artist); Crack cocaine; Drugs; Fatman Scoop; Graffiti Writers' Bench (The Bronx, N.Y.); Layups (Graffiti); Lk (Graffiti artist); Manhattan Vocational and Technical High School; Messengers; Morris Park Crew (Graffiti artist group); Rush (Graffiti artist); Scam 1 (Graffiti artist); Shoes--British walkers; Skeleton keys; Slim (Graffiti artist); The Ball Busters (Graffiti artist group); Zoologists

Subjects: Attempted murder; Drugs and addiction; Employment; Graffiti; Graffiti artists; High schools--United States; Hip-hop--Style; Racism; Robbery

Partial Transcript: COSE: Primarily, was a lot of oldies but goodies. I remember my father, my dad, he had this reel-to-reel. Damn, I'm old as a motherfucker. See, I'm old as a motherfucker. Really, I just revealed my, I said it already, but damn. So I remember that shit, and my father used to play like the Delfonics, Temptations, Stylistics, all the oldies but goodies, you know, from Motown . . .

Segment Synopsis: In this segment COSE speaks about the music he remembers hearing growing up, including Motown and Salsa, and he gets into the African and indigenous influences on Puerto Rican and Latino culture in general. He also talks about the indigenous culture and history of Puerto Rico. After remembering what kinds of food he ate while growing up, COSE dives into a reflection on the unique position of Puerto Ricans in relation to other Latinos, as simultaneously citizens and colonial subjects of the United States.

Keywords: Columbus, Christopher; Delfonics (Musical group); Gladys Knight and the Pips; Lopez, Jennifer, 1970-; Salsa (Music); Snaps; Sotomayor, Sonia, 1954-; Stylistics (Musical group); Temptations (Musical group)

Subjects: Arawak Indians; Cooking, Puerto Rican; Imperialism; Indigenous Americas; Latinos; Migration, Internal--United States; Motown classics; Puerto Ricans; Puerto Rico--History; Taino Indians

Partial Transcript: COSE: Again, that was like in the early '80s, like '81. When I went to high school that's when I really started riding trains, you know, like riding on a train. Cause, you know, I was in junior high school. I didn't have to take a subway as much . . .

Segment Synopsis: In this segment, COSE describes his process of becoming a graffiti writer, including his early experience writing on walls and other surfaces, his graduation to painting trains, and his first arrest on vandalism charges in 1983. COSE also talks about the different tag names he tried out and where "COSE" comes from, his first experience painting a train in 1981, what graffiti meant to him at the time, other graffiti artists he knew, and how his incarceration and subsequent drug use led to his missing out on the transition of graffiti to art galleries. He ends this segment by speaking about his crew, TDS, The Death Squad, how he got into it, memories of "racking", other members of TDS, and where the name of the crew came from.

Keywords: Bear 167 (Graffiti artist); Burners (Graffiti); Chain 3 (Graffiti artist); Coast (Soap firm); Cose (Graffiti artist); Crash (Graffiti artist); Daily news (New York, N.Y. : 1920); Death (Slang); Fame (Graffiti); Fashion Moda (Group); Gap1 (Graffiti artist); Graffiti Writers' Bench; Kool 131 (Graffiti artist); Layups (Graffiti); Magik Markers; Master Graffiti Artists (Graffiti artist group); Mitch 77 (Graffiti artist); Name (Graffiti); Part 1 (Graffiti artist); Quinones, Lee George; Racking (Graffiti); Seen (Graffiti artist), 1961-; Spray paint; Style (Graffiti); The Death Squad (Graffiti artist group); The Magnificent Team (Graffiti artist group); Throwups (Graffiti)

Subjects: Attempted murder; Drugs and addiction; Graffiti; Graffiti artists; Incarceration issues; Lettering in art; Subways; Tools in art; Vandalism

Partial Transcript: Kurt Boone: So, so the, when, when, when graffiti started getting noticed as an art form, you was kind of tied up . . .

COSE: I was in prison, I was in prison . . .

Segment Synopsis: In this segment of his oral history COSE gets more into how his incarceration and struggles with drugs pulled him away from graffiti during the 1980s. He also speaks about how art helped him achieve sobriety during the 2010s and shows a black book that documents this transition in his life.

Keywords: Almighty Latin King and Queen Nation (Gang); Angel dust; Bo (Graffiti artist); Canvas; Crack cocaine; Delta2 (Graffiti artist)

Subjects: Drug addicts--Rehabilitation; Drugs and addiction; Graffiti; Graffiti artists; Prisons--United States

Partial Transcript: COSE: I can talk about it, real brief. It was 1997, and I was in Rikers Island. Remember I told you my favorite subject is history and psychology . . .

Segment Synopsis: In this segment, COSE relates how he joined the Latin Kings on Rikers Island and conveys what he understands to be the group's mission: it is not meant to be a gang but rather an organization for the upliftment of the Latino community. He also talks about carrying on the legacy of the Young Lords and offers an analysis as to why some Young Lords stopped being revolutionaries over the years. The reason for this, COSE offers, is that the top 1% bought off a few of the more prominent Young Lords in order to maintain power.

Keywords: Almighty Latin King and Queen Nation (Gang); Black Panther Party; Bloods (Gang); Freemasons; Guzman, Pablo; Illuminati; King, Martin Luther, Jr., 1929-1968; Luciano, Felipe; Rikers Island (N.Y.); X, Malcolm, 1925-1965; Young Lords Party

Subjects: Class consciousness; Class struggle; Gangs--United States; Puerto Rico--History; Rikers Island (N.Y.); Secret societies; Young Lords (Organization)

Partial Transcript: COSE: What I'm doing with my art is that, art primarily is my passion right now. I have to say this, for, to get this really understood. 'Cause there might be someone watching this who might not understand what I'm saying . . .

Segment Synopsis: In this segment of his oral history COSE talks about his current work and future ambitions when it comes to art. He touches on how art brings balance to his life, his aim to be in major galleries in the near future, his sense of pride over graffiti becoming a worldwide phenomenon, and the development of his current artistic style and entrepreneurial strategy.

Keywords: Banksy; Cope2 (Graffiti artist); Oppression; Outside the Box (Art series); Sands, Leia (Artist); Sotheby's (Firm); Trademarks

Subjects: Art; Art galleries, Commercial; Entrepreneurship--Art; Global culture; Graffiti

Partial Transcript: COSE: So, my friend, my close friend, DELTA 2, he doesn't really like to go to shows, and he's always like trying to like tell me, "Oh, I don't, I don't wanna to go to those shows." I don't go, I don't just go to graffiti shows, even though my, my origins are graffiti art. I go to all kinds of art shows.

Segment Synopsis: In this segment, COSE speaks about going to shows for many different styles of art for inspiration, the tools he used for graffiti back in the day and some of what he uses now, different spray paint brands and what he would use for extra caps, and how innovative early graffiti writers had to be as far as their tools went, even though outside companies now have capitalized on this innovation. He also draws parallels with the ways in which innovations in Black rhythm and blues was repackaged in part for white audiences as "rock and roll" in the middle of the twentieth century and the more recent commercialization of hip hop.

Keywords: 20th century rock and roll; Blick; Delta 2 (Graffiti artist); Gangsta rap (Music); Hip-hop; Krylon (Spray paint); Montana (Spray paint); One Art Space (Art gallery); Red Devil (Spray paint); Rust-Oleum (Spray paint)

Subjects: Graffiti; Hip-hop; Popular music--African American influences; Spray paint--Brands; Spray paint--Caps; Tools in art

Partial Transcript: COSE: 6 line. I'm a 6 line legend.

Segment Synopsis: In this segment COSE discusses the 6 line, which he painted along the most, the stations that he would paint at along this line, how he gained access to these stations, and more.

Keywords: Brook Avenue station; Cypress Avenue station; East 143rd Street–St. Mary's Street station; Layups (Graffiti); Longwood Avenue station; Middletown Road station; Skeleton keys; St. Lawrence Avenue station; Westchester Square station

Subjects: 6 Lexington Avenue Local; <6> Pelham Bay Park Express; Graffiti; Subways--New York (State)--New York

Partial Transcript: COSE: So I got an idea. Remember, I told you, I didn't get to express it to you. Leia, my girl, told me it's gonna take me awhile, and she's right. It's gonna take me maybe more than a year. So you tell me. Nobody's thought about this trust me.

Segment Synopsis: In this segment COSE speaks about a project he is currently working on in which he will be collaborating with many graffiti pioneers from the generation of artists before his own.

Keywords: Boots 119 (Graffiti artist); Butch 2 (Graffiti artist); Golden Era (Graffiti); Outside the Box (Art series); Pioneers (Graffiti); Quinones, Lee George; Riff (Graffiti artist); Seen (Graffiti artist), 1961-

Subjects: Canvas; Graffiti; Subways--New York (State)--New York

Partial Transcript: COSE: No, it's, it's not like a gang. It's, it's, you know, graffiti crews, people, if they respect you and you put a lot of work in, they'll approach you. They'll be like, "Yo, you should put up 'TDS', or put up 'OTB'. Yo, you wanna get down with us?"

Segment Synopsis: In this segment COSE speaks more about his graffiti crew, The Death Squad (TDS), and how he became involved in it. He also relates a series of events in 1983 that led to his first arrest for graffiti writing and involved the infamous Vandal Squad cops Hickey and Ski. COSE reflects some on the impact of drugs on his personal life and the graffiti community during the 1980s, which led to him and many others missing out on the notoriety and acceptance in the art community that a few graffiti writers started to receive at this time.

Keywords: Bo (Graffiti artist); Bombing (Graffiti); Crash (Graffiti artist); Daily news (New York, N.Y. : 1920); Fleet Messenger Service (Firm); Futura (Graffiti artist); Hickey, Kevin; John 1 (Graffiti artist); Layups (Graffiti); Lesnewski, Conrad ("Ski"); Motion tagging (Graffiti); Out To Bomb (Graffiti artist group); The Death Squad (Graffiti artist group); Zerega Avenue Subway station

Subjects: Drugs and addiction; Graffiti; Initiation; Messengers; Style Wars; Subway stations--New York (State); Vandalism; Wild Style

Partial Transcript: COSE: I was featured in this magazine here. I didn't show you this. So, this is called the Creative Artist Magazine. This is the Spring/Summer 2021 issue, and I have a little, little centerfold in there, where I was featured. And, you know, it just makes me good that people actually put my artwork in a magazine.

Segment Synopsis: In this segment COSE speaks some about the amazing artistic come back he has launched over the last number of years, his current artistic habits, and how he is gaining more and more recognition.

Keywords: A1 (Graffiti artist); Creative Artist Magazine (Art magazine); Heck (Graffiti artist); John 1 (Graffiti artist); RW (Graffiti artist); Toxic (Graffiti artist)

Subjects: Canvas; Cose (Graffiti artist)

Partial Transcript: COSE: One of my favorite, well I got a whole car, up top-to-bottom, but the one that I really like enjoy is a blockbuster that me and Elkay did . . .

Segment Synopsis: In this segment COSE talks about a variety of artistic considerations, including his favorite pieces he produced during the 1980s, the colors he's drawn to, the importance of stories behind art, and how he gets into the artistic zone right now. He also shares some of the challenges of having other responsibilities aside from art, like working as a drug counselor and raising his son. He closes the segment by speaking about how his recent reception of a Certificate of Merit from the Bronx Borough President made him feel and how this ties into his general artistic comeback.

Keywords: 6 line; Blockbuster style (Graffiti); Elkay (Graffit artist); Pandemic; Purple; Racking (Graffiti); Soundview (The Bronx, N.Y.); Top-to-bottoms (Graffiti); Whole cars (Graffiti)

Subjects: Artists' studios in art; Colors; Drug abuse counseling; Ecstasy in art; Graffiti; Graffiti artists; Music & art; Narrative and art; Single-parent families; Subways--New York (State)--New York

Partial Transcript: COSE: The Bronx for me is home, it's, it's, you know, The Bronx is home. It's the birthplace of hip hop. It's the birthplace of a lot of things, you know, but for the most part the biggest one that I can, really sticks out in my mind is hip hop. And, you know, I was there, I was part of that movement . . .

Segment Synopsis: In this final segment COSE reflects on what The Bronx means to him and how the borough's history is reflective of his own life, ups and downs and all. He also provides his tag.

Keywords: Bronx (New York, N.Y.); Tag (Graffiti)

Subjects: Bronx (New York, N.Y.); Drugs and addiction; Graffiti; Hip-hop